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Re: English sailors and Turkish sailor Artillery from Redbox

Revell also made the (in)famous big and expensive 'Spanish Galleon' and 'English Man O'War' models. Scale officially 1/96 but 1/72 figures match well. But these ships are just generic and (30 years ago)meant to be more a decorative furniture than a painstakingly constructed replica. Especially the masts are far too high. Without the upper sails (top gallants)the overall shape will improve.

True, cannot recommend these kits. I'd not call them "generic". They don't have a lot to do with the actual thing. The proportions are just ridiculous. You've already mentioned the far too high masts. The stern area is too high and far too protruding as well in relation to the overall hull, the bow is too narrow, the galion to massive in relation to the narrowness of the bow, etc. On the whole, a joke.

Revell has re-released the same old "Spanish Galleon" kit in a new box representing a ship with approximately the correct dimensions/proportions. By doing so, they are fooling the unaware customer. I'd call it a swizz!

Here you can compare the box art, representing a reasonably dimensioned galleon of the time, and the model you actually get, a Disneyland caricature of a galleon:

As for the railing of the Mayflower. It's ok. Well, you have to remove the bases of the figures, of course. No wonder the railings look as if they were too low. However, railings were not that high anyway. Look at this painting by Vroom, for example:

As for the scale of both the Airfix Golden Hind (meant to represent a small war galleon) and the Revell Mayflower (meant to represent a small merchant galleon), remember that both ships are reconstructions not replicas. That is, the exact appearance and dimensions of the actual ships are not known, they are approximative/guesses (usually, all we know from contemporary sources is tonnage, keel-beam ratio, and the like). As a consequence, the size of the figures is relative as well. One could easily argue that the Revell figures have been made a bit too short and tiny in comparison to the ship itself which, as mentioned, goes very well together with the Golden Hind (for which the size of such features as doors or gun ports is a good indicator ).

Generally, one must also bear in mind that everything on board those ships tended to be crowded and small from a modern point of view (the ships themselves would have been of the same type but built in all sizes, from huge to midget). Same as can be observed e.g. with period cottages. Modern humans usually have to stoop when crossing the rooms...

Re: English sailors and Turkish sailor Artillery from Redbox

You all should think BIGGER!

How about this vessel? Row row row Your boat!

Re: English sailors and Turkish sailor Artillery from Redbox

We all?

Check the thread "Turkish sailors!" below...

Yes Giorgio, that's what we'd like to see as well : 16th - 17th century galley slave oarsmen.

Would be fun to be able to man the Réale de France (in 1/75):

The Réale de France had 31 oars to starboard and 60 oars to port (one thwart was omitted to make room for the caboose).

Well, you just need 427 oarsmen, 7 oarsmen in slightly different poses for each oar on the larboard and starboard sides respectively. That is 14 slightly different poses of oarsmen for each pair of oars. If a box contained oarsmen for 3 pairs of oars, i. e. 42 oarsmen, you'd still need 11 boxes to man the Réale de France. Hey, Red Box, that's big business. Don't miss the opportunity!

It's "30 oars to port", of course. Sorry

Re: English sailors and Turkish sailor Artillery from Redbox

You are right. Revell’s Spanish Galleon is Disney’s castle afloat. The new box art deceives the buyer. But there are just few plastic model kits available, if you want a vessel from the 16th century in nearly 1/72. (I tried to convert Revell’s Spanish Galleon by altering the masts, shortening the gallion (and the stem), reducing the superstructure (poop deck) by one storey and removing the upper balcony. But that still is more ease the pain rather than a cure. So I didn’t finish that major surgery yet.

On the other hand, some war gamers prefer straight out of the box gaming to extreme modeling (and use unpainted figures). In that case matching scale and easy assembly might be sufficient. Even then, there’s a very exclusive club of vessels available: the Airfix Golden Hind, the oop IMAI/ERTL Golden Hind, the big Revell/Heller Mayflower and the ‘ fictitious fantasy’ Revell Spanish Galleon/English Man O’War caricatures. IMAI’s chebec IMHO is rather 18th century.

Right again, all these are best guesses to reconstruct a generic ship, since no original, even plan did survive. Also most 16th/17th century artists were no sailors themselves and could misapprehend dimensions or details. (Some of the few seadogs was the Dutch artist Zeeman). Personally I visited some of the few survivers like the Vasa, the Victory and the Bremen cog. The latter BTW featured planks running from port to starboard, not lenghthwise as usual. (Zvezda hasn’t noticed that…)

Using the gun port sizes as a lead is a clever idea!

Another way may be scaling up paper craft models. I’ll try that soon. Shipyard does some very decent ones. Like the Revenge (1/96):

Here’s a work in progress pic which I found in a paper modeler’s forum:

Re: English sailors and Turkish sailor Artillery from Redbox

IMAI’s chebec IMHO is rather 18th century.

Absolutely correct. I think that in principle it's based on the same ship as Hellers 1/50 chebec, i.e. the French mid-18th century Requin, or so...

Bob Richman said he was looking for a lateen rigged ship to be used for a later period. So I thought this was it...

English sailor in battle and artillery are up to


The last two sets with english sailors are up to

wery nice