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My last message should have course read "carabinier style helmets".
I have just seen the conformation that 061 is the Russian Uhlans set but no news of the Turks and the French Chassuers.
Did someone say French Cavalry, or Turks, or Sardinians or ... ???
Oh my, oh my, I love the Crimean Campaign !!!
Sardinian Cavalry with helm in Crimea?
Moreover those masters shows no lance/carabins...
There was a staff officer from one of the lancer regiments there.
I have the OOB of the Sardinias at home. If you like I can mail you these. But from my mind I think there were no lancers, just some Cavalegieri in the Crimea.
Forgive me but this MAY help....contemporary source
General Cadogans Crimea(amateur waterpaint artist attached to La Marmora's HQ Cadogans Crimea available 2nd hand on ebay,amazon etc ) shows Sardinian Lancers (5) on page 121 escorting Marmosa behind a Besaglieri advance(.A possible police body guard platoon with lances ? not had time to inspect regimental roles yet )
THE SARDINIAN ARMY AND NAVY IN 1854
By Mark Conrad, 1994.
The Sardinian expeditionary force sent to the Crimea in 1855 was made up of detachments drawn from the various peacetime units. These The details of provisional battalions and regiments can be found in the excellent booklet
Crimean War Basics, Part One, by Cox and Lenton.
This article, though, presents the prewar organization which was the basis for the Sardinian contingent sent to the Crimea. The source is the Official Military Yearbook of the Sardinian State for Year 1854, published by the Ministry of War in Turin. To copy is held by the New York Public Library. The information in the Military Yearbook was supposed to be current as of 1 January 1854. Place names to are given in Italian, I know the reader may need to be reminded that Turin is Turin, Genoa is Genoa, and Nizza is Nice (now in France).
Company of the Guards of the Body of Its Maesta, With. knight Carl Cordero di Belvedere; garrison: Turin. Hat with decoration and to plume of capon feathers, scarlet collar and facings with two loops of silver embroidery, dark-blue pants with to scarlet cloth stripe down the side. Officers' distinctions - cartridge-pouch with to crossbelt trimmed in silver. Musket. The body of this company was about 50 sub-lieutenants called simple guards.
Company of the Real Guards of the Palace, Lt. With. knight Camillo Solano di Villanova; garrison: Turin. Hat with decoration, scarlet collar and facings with two loops of gold lace, dark-blue pants with to scarlet stripe down the side. Sergeants' distinctions - cartridge-pouch with crossbelt. Musket. The body of this company was about 90 non-commissioned officers.
Body Real of General Staff (the General Staff); General commander of the Body Maj. Gen. knight Enrico Morozzo of the Rocca; headquarters: Turin. Hat with decoration and to dark-blue falling plume, dark-blue collar and facings with an embroidered gold loop, dark-blue pants with gold lace and dark-blue stripe down the side, gold appointments and trim. This corps was made up of to Body of Uffiziale and an Topographical Office.
Military divisions and Subdivisions, Provincial Military Commandos and of the Fortresses (Military Divisions and Sub-Divisions, Military Commands of Provinces and Fortresses). Staff members wear to hat with decoration, dark-blue collar and facings with gold embroidered buttonholes, gold appointments. Distinctions according to rank.
Division of Turin, General of the Army knight Ettore Gerbaix de-Sonnaz. Cities and Provinces of: Turin (Commander With. knight Bernardo Mezzena), Connecting rod (Lt. With. knight Carl Goria), Ivrea (Lt.Col. marquis Filippo Augusto Paulucci), Pinerolo (Lt. With. knight Augustin Giusiana), Susa (Lt. With. conte Sulpizio Savin de Bosses), Aosta (Maj. Michele knight Pope of Costigliole), Wedge (Lt. With the knight Gaetano Molmatti), Dawn (Lt. Col. Giovanni Peter Anselmi), and Mondovi (Lt. With conte Eusebio Mayno di Capriglio). Citadel of Turin (the colonel commanding the garrison' s infantry regiment); Fortress of: Fenestrelle (the lieutenant colonel commanding the Body of the Hunters Franchi), Fortress d' Exilles (noble Maj. Teodoro Alberti).
Division of Savoia; Lt. Gen. Ardingo knight Trots. City of Chambéry and Province of Savoia-Propria (Lt. With. knight Bernardino Vallino); City of Albertville and Province of Alta-Savoia (Lt. Col. Giovanni Maria De Coucy); City of Thonon and Province of Chiablese (Lt. With. knight Giovanni Giuseppe Crud); City of Bonneville and Province of Faucigny (Lt. Col. Francisco Paul); City of S. Giovanni Moriana and Province of Moriana (Maj. Caspar Verani); City of Annecy and Province of Genevese (Lt. Col. Antonio Giovanni Bellando Batiste); City of Moutiers and Province of Tarantasia (Maj. Peter Antonio Gerard-Piolan); Fortress of Lesseillon (Lt. Col. Francisco Gazzera).
Division of Alexandria; Lt. Gen. knight Giovanni Lasting. City, Province, and Citadel of Alexandria (Col. knight Leopoldo Rasini di Mortigliengo); Cities and Provinces of: Waters (Col. knight Bonifacio Bigliani), Hatred (Col. knight Maurizio Falletti di Villafalletto), Tortona (Col. baron Casimiro De Benst), Country house (Lt. With. knight Stefano Fornaca), and Voghera (Lt. Col. Caspar Dupuy).
Division of Genoa; Lt. Gen. knight Alexander Gerrero of the Marmora. City, Province, and forts of Genoa (Col. knight Giovanni Batttista Comola); Cities and Provinces of: Albenga (Lt. With. Happy Don Maria Nailer), Bobbio (Lt. Col. Cassimiro Serralunga), Chiavari (Lt. With. knight Bartolomeo Aitelli), Spezia (Lt. Col. Maj. knight Emilio Rocci), Novi (Lt. Col. Allesandro Horses), and Savona (Lt. Col. Francisco Gianolio); Strongly of Gavi (Maj. Luigi Casalis).
Subdivision of Novara; the major general commanding the garrison' s brigade. Cities and Provinces of: Novara (Lt. With. knight Francisco Allasia), Pallanza (Lt. Col. Prospero Gavuzzi), and Vercelli (Lt. With. knight Giuseppe Raybaudi of the Cainea); City of Mortara and Province of Lomellina (Lt. With. Sesare knight of the Church of Cervignasco); City of Domogossola and Province of Ossola (Lt. Col. Francisco Reyna); City of Varallo and Province of Valesia (Maj. Hannibal Sapelli).
Sotto' Divmone of Nizza; the major general commanding the garrisoned brigade; Cities and Provinces of Nizza (Nice) (Lt.Col. knight Carl Ruggero Bellegarde), Oneglia (Maj. knight Benedict Raschieri Coast), and S. Remo (Lt. With. conte Giacomo Short); Forts of Villafranca (Maj. conte Happy Carl Vacha di Piè di Cavallo) and Ventimiglia (Maj. conte Luigi Burotti di Scagnello).
Principality of Monaco; General commander Prince Florestano of Monaco.
Division of the Island of Sardinia (Island of Sardinia); Cities and Provinces of Cagliari (Lt. With. Don Rafaele Salazar), Iglesias (Maj. knight Don Giuseppe Roych Maria), Oristano (Maj. knight Augustin Carchero); Isili (Capt Gavino Campus); Sassari (Lt. With. knight Francisco of the Church of the Forre); Lanusei (Maj. Antonio Moneies); Cuglieri (Capt. Don Antonio Maramaldo of the Minerva); Tempio (Maj. Andrea Novara); Ozieri (Lt. With. knight Francisco Cao); and Nuoro (Lt. With. Don Vincenzo Short). Districts: San' antioco (Lieut. Antonio Bards), Fort Carl and Island of S. Peter (Lieut. Giuseppe Marchetti), Island of S. Teresa (Lieut. Lorenzo Rugiu). Fortification (strong Public square) of Alghero (Lt. With. knight Don Giuseppe Castles).
Body of the Royal Carabinieri ; Commander of the Body Maj. Gen. knight Federico Lovera Demaria; headquarters (greater Statto) in Turin. Hat with decoration and blue and red plume, dark-blue coat with collar and facings of the same color, decorated with two small silver lace loops, scarlet turnbacks, dark-blue pants with to scarlet stripe down the side, silver epaulettes, white braided cords. Divisions of Turin (Maj. knight Trofino Arnulfi), Savoia (Maj. knight Ferdinand Martin-Montù Beccaria), Alexandria (Maj. knight Giovanni De-Bardy Batistes), Genoa (Lt. With. knight Telemaco Ceva di Nuceto), Wedge (Col. Run knight Peter of Bosnasco), Novara (Maj. knight Giuseppe Demagistris), and Nizza (Capt. marquis Filippo Ollandi).
Body of the Royal Carabinieri of Sardinia; Commander of the Body With. knight Antonio Martino Massida; headquarters in Cagliari. Blue kepi with horsehair plume, blue collar and facings, grey pants with to dark-blue stripe down the side, silver epaulettes, white braided cords. Divisions of Cagliari (Lt. With. Don knight Giovanni Batistes Serpi) and Sassari (Maj. Giovanni Rebaudengo Batistes).
Brigade Grenadiers of Sardinia (Sardinian Grenadier Brigade); Maj. Gen. conte Marcello Gianotti; garrison: Genoa. Dark-blue kepi, scarlet collar with white lace, scarlet piping, grey pants.
1or Regiment of the Grenadiers of Sardinia; Lt.Col. conte Augusto Mass of S. Biagio.
2or Regiment of the Grenadiers of Sardinia; With. knight Roberto Morozzo of the Rocca.
Savoia Brigade; Maj. Gen. conte Umberto Jaillet de S. Cergues. Dark-blue kepi, special scarlet neckties, black velvet collar, scarlet piping, grey pants.
1or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. Col. Luigi Francisco Perrier; garrison: Novara (one company detached to Arona and another to Mortara).
2or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Luigi Mudry; garrison: Vercelli (two battalions detached to Country house and one company to Connecting rod).
Piemonte Brigade; With. conte Giacomo Carderina. Dark-blue kepi, scarlet collar scarlet piping along the buttons of the tunic, down the skirt, and on the cuff-flaps, grey pants.
3or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Augustin Gastinelli; garrison: Chambery.
4or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Domenico Cuchiarri; garrison: Annecy) (one company detached to Thonon, one to Bonneville, one to Moutiers, one to Pontbeauvoisin, and two to Albertville).
Aosta Brigade; Maj. Gen. knight Georgio Ansaldi; garrison: Turin. Particulars as for Piemonte Brigade except for the scarlet piping along the buttons and skirt of the tunic.
5or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Hannibal Arnaldi.
6or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. Col. Alexander Plocchiu.
Brigade Wedge; With. knight Paul Antonio Decavero; garrison: Alexandria (one company detached to Gavi (Novi) and another to Bobbio). Dark-blue kepi, crimson collar and piping, grey pants.
7or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Luigi Filippo Gozzani di Treville.
8or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. With. Knight Enrico Cerale.
Brigade the Queen; With. knight Luigi Scoziadi Calliano. Dark-blue kepi, white collar, white piping along the buttons of the chest, the skirt of the tunic, and on the cuff-flaps, grey pants.
9or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. With. nobleman Giovanni Francisco de Rolland; garrison: Cagliari.
10or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. Col. Carl Camerana; garrison: Sassari.
Brigade Country house; Maj. Gen. Don knight Augustin Fara; garrison: Nizza (one battalion in Monaco, two companies at Ventimiglia, one at Oneglia, and another at Mentone). Dark-blue kepi, yellow collar, yellow piping along the buttons of the chest, the skirt of the tunic, and on the cuff-flaps, grey pants.
11or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. With. knight Lorenzo Vittorio Filippi.
12or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. Col. Matteo Tawny Caspar.
Pinerolo Brigade; Maj. Gen. knight Luigi Damiano; garrison: Alexandria. Like Savoia Brigade except for the neckties which is black as for all the other regiments, instead of being scarlet.
13or Regiment of Infantry, With. conte Maximum Bocchiardo di S. Vitale.
14or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Enrico Cialdini.
Savona Brigade; Maj. Gen. knight Peter Pilo-Boyl di Putifigari; garrison: Genoa. Like Brigade the white Queen except for the piping along the buttons and skirt of the tunic.
15or Regiment of Infantry; Lt. With. knight Luigi Bianchis di Pomaretto.
16or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Alexander Luigi de S. Pierre.
Water brigade; Maj. Gen. Vittorio knight Dolphin; garrison: Turin. Like Brigade Country house except for the yellow piping along the buttons and skirt of the tunic.
17or Regiment of Infantry; With. knight Filiberto Mollard.
18or Regiment of Infantry; With. Danish knight Alexander.
Body of the Bersaglieres; commander of the body With. knight Giuseppe Savant; headquarters in Wedge. Hemispherical hat with to round, broad brim and to plume of capon feathers hanging down on the right side, dark-blue wool tunic, crimson collar and trim, dark-blue wool jacket, dark-blue cloak, dark-blue pants, green woolen cords.
1or Battalion - Maj. knight Vincenzo Radicati di Primeglio.
2or Battalion - Maj. Luigi Vincenzo Galliums.
3or Battalion - also Maj. Galliums.
4or Battalion - Maj. Giovanni Morand.
All four of the first battalions to were headquartered in Wedge. Six companies to were detached: one at Fossano, one at Dawn, one at Saranza, one at Saluzzo, another at Mondovl, and one at Oneglia.
5or Battalion - Maj. knight Augusto Bertaldi; Genoa.
6or Battalion - Maj. knight Giovanni Balegno di Carpenetto; Ozieri (with two companies at Nuoro).
7or Battalion - Maj. Camillo knight Church of the Tower; Savona.
8or Battalion - Maj. knight Luigi Biglione di Viariggi; Turin.
9or Battalion - Maj. Luigi Beretta; Chambéry.
10or Battalion - Maj. Francisco Cassinis; Genoa.
Company of Warehouse (Depot Company) - Lt. Giuseppe Silvestro Vayra.
Body of the Franchi Hunters; Lt. With. nob. Fiancesco Campania; headquarters: Fenestrelle (with three detached Companies: the 3to Company in Lesseillon, the 4to in Bard, and the 5to in of Exilles). Black felt kepi, dark-blue collar, yellow piping, grey pants. This was to disciplinary labor corps.
Cavalry of Line:
Nizza Regiment Cavalry; Lt. With. conte Luigi de Kalbermatten; garrison: Vercelli Crested helmet, crimson collar and piping, grey pants with to double dark- blue stripe down the side, white metal epaulettes.
Real Piemonte Regiment Cavalry; With. conte Rodolfo Montevecchio; garrison: Pinerolo. Crested helmet, scarlet collar and piping, grey pants with to double dark-blue stripe down the side, white epaulettes.
Savoia Regiment Cavalry; Lt. With. knight Carl Augusto Brunetta d' Usseaux; garrison: Savigliano. Crested helmet, black velvet collar, scarlet piping, grey pants with to double dark-blue band down the side, white epaulettes.
Genoa Regiment Cavalry; Lt. With. knight Lion Hannibal Signoris di Buronzo; garrison: Saluzzo. Crested helmet, yellow collar and piping, grey pants with to double dark-blue stripe down the side, white epaulettes.
Cavalleggieri regiment of Novara; Lt. With. knight Federico Morozzo of the Rocca; garrison: Country house (with two squadrons in Alexandria). White woolen cord, dark-blue collar, white piping, grey pants with to double dark-blue stripe, white White kepi adorned with to horse-hair plume and to epaulettes.
Cavalleggieri regiment of Aosta; Lt. With. knight Enrico Vittorio Emanuele Martini di Cigala; garrison: Vigevano (one squadron detached to Novara). Scarlet kepi adorned with to black plume and scarlet cords, dark-blue collar, scarlet piping, pants and epaulettes as for the Novara Regiment.
Regiment Cavalleggieri di Saluzzo; Lt. Col. Paul Griffini; garrison: Voghera (with one squadron in Genoa). Yellow kepi adorned with to black plume and yellow cords, dark-blue collar, yellow piping, pants and epaulettes as for the Novara Regiment.
Regiment Cavalleggieri di Monferrato; Lt. With. conte Maurice Gerbaix di Sonnaz; garrison: Chambéry. Crimson kepi adorned with to black plume and crimson cords, dark-blue collar, crimson piping, pants and epaulettes as for the Novara Regiment.
Cavalleggieri regiment of Alexandria; Lt. With. conte Carl Bracorens de Savoiroux; garrison: Turin. Orange kepi adorned with to black plume and orange cords, dark-blue collar, orange piping, pants and epaulettes as for the Novara Regiment.
Real body of Artillery:
Commando General and Greater Stato of the Body (Headquarters and Staff); General of the Army S.A.R. (H.R.H.) Prince Ferdinand di Savoia, Duca of Genoa, in Turin. Dark-blue kepi adorned with to black horse-hair plume for lower ranks or to feather plume for officers, collar and facings of black velvet trimmed with yellow piping, woolen cords, yellow metal epaulettes, dark-blue pants with to yellow stripe down the side.
Committee centers them of Artillery (Central Artillery Committee); Chemical laboratory and Direction Foundry (Chemical Laboratory and Royal Foundry); Direction Factory of Crews (Royal Arms Factory); Direction Factory Powders (Royal Powder Factory), in Genoa; Laboratory Bombardieri and Cassuleria (Bombadier Laboratory and Establishment Caps); Workshops of Construction (Office of Construction), in Turin; Preparation Convoys (Establishment for Preparation of Convoys); Workshops of Construction, in Genoa; Direction Factory Powders, in Turin; Direction Factory Powders, in Cagliari; various 1st, 2nd, and 3rd class local artillery commands (local Commandos of artillery).
Regiment Laborers (Operations Regiment); With. knight Peter Actis; headquarters and companies in Turin.
Regiment from Public square (Static Artillery); With, baron Achille De-Bottini; headquarters in Turin.
1.a Brigade: 1.a Company of Public square, Cagliari; 2.a Company of Public square, Alexandria; 3.a, 4.a, 5.a, and 6.a Companies of Public square, Genoa.
2.a Brigade: 7.a, 8.a, 9.a, 10.a, 11.a, and 12.a Companies of Public square, garrison Turin.
Regiment from Campaign (Field Artillery); With. knight Leopoldo Valfre di Bonzo; headquarters in Real Veneria.
1.a Brigade: 1.a and 2.a Horse Batteries (Horse Batteries), Real Veneria.
2.a Brigade: 1.a Battery of Battle, Chambéry; 2.a Battery of Battle, Genoa; 3.a Battery of Battle, Vercelli.
3.a Brigade: 4.a, 5.a, and 6.a Batteries of Battle, Real Veneria.
4.a Brigade: 7.a, 8.a, and 9.a Batteries of Battle, Turin.
5.a Brigade: 10.a, 11.a, and 12.a Batteries of Battle, Real Veneria.
6.a Brigade: 13.a, 14.a, and 15.a Batteries of Battle, Real Veneria.
7.a Brigade: 16.a, 17.a, and 18.a Batteries of Battle, Alexandria.
Body of the Genius:
Council of the Genius and General Commando (Engineer Council and General Command); headquarters, Turin; Maj. Gen. knight Francisco Antonio Olivero. Hat with decoration and falling black plume, crimson velvet collar, dark-blue pants, silver appointments.
Zappatori regiment of the Genius (Sappers); Lt.Col. knight Domenico Staglieno; headquarters and two battalions of five companies each, in Country house. Felt shako with to broad, round brim, ornamented around the top with white tape, and with to red horse- hair plume; collar and pants as for the staff and headquarters of the Corps.
Various directorates (Direzionzi of the Genius) in the Military Divisions.
Body of the Train of Army; With. conte Carl de-Genoa di Pettinengo; headquarters in Turin. Four companies. Felt kepi ornamented with to black and scarlet horse-hair plume, collar and facings dark-blue with scarlet piping, grey pants with to double dark-blue stripe down the side, white epaulettes.
Military higher council of Health (Superior Council on Military Medicines).
Military Sanitary body, comprising doctors (doctors), druggists (pharmacists), and veterinaries (veterinarians).
Military hospitals divisionarii and branches (Divisional and Branch Military Hospitals): Turin (1st class), branches in Wedge, Pinerolo, Saluzzo, Veneria, Fenestrelle, Exilles, and Bard; Genoa (1st class); Alexandria (1st class), branch in Country house; Chambéry (2nd class), branches in Annecy and Lesseillon; Novara (2nd class), branches in Vercelli and Vigevano; Nizza (2nd class), branch in Monaco; Cagliari (2nd class), branches in Sassari, Nuoro, Ozieri, and Tempio.
Company Military Nurses, Maj. Peter Borgarelli. Dark-blue kepi, dark-blue collar, light-blue facings, grey pants.
Real house of Invalids (Royal Invalids Home); With. knight Carl Ferreri; Hatred. Same uniform as for the infantry, crimson collar and facings. Comprising: Battalion of Invalids, made up of five centurie (centuries); Companies Veteran, comprising to Sott' Company uffiziali (noncommissioned officers) in Hatred, and the 1.a through 4.a Companies ordinary in Hatred, Aosta, Pallanza, and Albenga, respectively.
Other Support Services and Establishments
Spiritual service, comprising forty-five chaplains (military chaplains).
Military confinement (Military Prison) and Company Moschettieri (Musketeers). Dark-blue kepi, dark-blue collar ornamented with to loop, light-blue facings, grey pants, white epaulettes. In Savona.
Complementary school for the officials of the special crews (Secondary School for officers of special arms) - Turin.
Military Direction Academy - Turin; dark-blue kepi with to dark-blue plume, crimson collar and facings, grey pants with to crimson stripe, silver epaulettes for the Student Cadets.
Collegia pel Military Sons of (College for Sons of Military Personnel) - in Racconigi; dark-blue kepi, dark-blue collar and facings with scarlet piping, grey pants.
Military school of Infantry - Ivrea.
Military school of Music - Hatred.
Military school of Cavalry - Pinerolo.
Withdrawal for the Daughters of the Soldiers (Retreat for Daughters of Military Personnel) - Turin.
Warehouse of Cavalli-Stalloni (Cavalry Depot); Warehouse of Real Venaria; Warehouse of Annecy.
Tanca of Pauli-Latin, in Sardinia, (tanca = reservoir).
Ministry of War and Dependent Administrations
Ministry of War: Minister of the war and Minister of Lt Navy. Gen. of the Army knight Alfonso Ferrero of the Marmora; General Secretariat (General Secretariat); Director general's office (General Directorates).
Amministrationi Employee: General inspection of the Levers (General Inspectorate of the Conscription), General Uditorato of War (General Military Auditoriat), in Turin and the Divisions, Body of the Military Intendancies (Intendance Corps), in the Divisions; Regal Warehouse of the Goodses (Royal Stores Magazine); Quartier Master for the army (Army Quartermaster); Administration of the military subsistences (Military Subsistence Administration), in the garrisons; Material book keeping staff pel of Artillery (Artillery Materiel Accountants); Book keeping staff pel service of the Corps of Engineers (Military Engineer Accountants).
Military navy (Navy) and Ministry of Navy (Ministry of the Navy)
Real body of Navy, Admiral S.A.R. (Admiral H.R.H.) Prince Eugene di Savoia-Carignano.
Real body Crews (Crews), including the Company maestranza of real marine of the 165 technicians and craftsmen at the arsenal in Genoa.
Navy Corps of Engineers (Naval Engineers). Until 1855, however, Army engineers to were responsible for port construction and hydraulic works.
Real battalion Ships (Royal Naval Battalion), Genoa, of six companies totaling 475 men and 25 officers.
Military medical body of the R. navy, composed of Medical Officials (Uffiziali Sanitary), Religious Officials (Spiritual Services) of the Marine Direction.
Commando of the Island of Capraia (Island of Capraia, near Elba); numerous 1st through 4th class ports.
Military school of Navy, in Genoa.
The following list of ships is taken from the Army of the old Piemonte, the orderings; Part II—From 1814 to 1859, by Nicholas Brancaccio and published by the Ministry of the War in 1925.
Mark COnrads super tranlation with paddle steamers and shipping details is the SOURCE
LOOK AT THIS OTHER TRANSLATED WORK INTO ENGLISH by Herman Van Mier
http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/crimean_war/102522/1 ee 2,3 4 5 (50 pages) vg read
I stil reckon 63 is Chasseurs D'Afrique
The way they are holding the sabres looks more arabesque.(Turk cavalry was a thought)
Headgear looks nearly negative(shamal ? ) All part of the guessing game.sTRELETS MENTIONED AWHILE BACK THEY'D DO uHLANS so no surprise, crafty confusing us with blue plastic.
However if Strelets done a sARDINIAN CAVALRY WOW beats expectations.
Ha, ha - Sardinian cavalry. I have a lot of wishes, but I fear that this unit would be two exotic for the Crimean war. You can convert the two Piemontese staff officers who joint the charge of the light brigade.
If these guys would be Sardinians, I would hope for more Italian stuff, which I need for 1848/59/66.
I sure hope you are correct in your predictions. I too would love to see Chasseurs D'Afrique, Turkish Cavalry, and Sardinian Cavalry produced by the fine S*R Team in truly soft plastic in 1/72.
You keep recommending these sets and I'll support you !!!
Happy Collecting Mate !!!
see bottom suite101 website - excellent sources sardinain cavalry in support of French and Turks.
5 sub webpages 10 pages each .Narrative of Sardinian involvement from their perspective..
The following list of ships is taken from the Army of the old Piemonte, the orderings; Part II—From 1814 to 1859, by Nicholas Brancaccio and published by the Ministry of the War in 1925.
Sailing vessels: Frigate Beroldo, 44 guns.
Frigate DES Geneys, 44 guns.
Euridice corvettes, 32 guns.
Frigate S. Michele, 62 guns.
Brigantine Dawn, 20 guns.
Aquila corvettes, 18 guns.
S Corvettes. Giovanni, 32 guns.
Brigantine Courier, reduced to to stores ship.
Brigantine Fallow deer, 14 guns.
Brigantine Columbus, 18 guns.
Brigantine Eridano, 18 guns.
Steam vessels: Paddle wheeler Gulnara, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler Ichnusa, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler Tripoli, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler Malfatano, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler Authion, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler Mozambano, 4 guns.
Paddle wheeler frigate Governolo, 10 guns.
Paddle wheeler frigate Constitution, 10 guns.
Screw frigate Carl Alberto, 45 guns.
Screw frigate Vittori Emanuele, 45 guns.
The Carl Alberto was built in England, as to were the engines of all the steam vessels. The only paddle wheeler subsequently acquired was the transport Dora, in 1855. Also acquired for the Crimean campaign in 1855 to were the screw transports Tanaro and Varo.
Sardinia and the War - Part 4Herman Van Meir Oct 31, 2003.(Hope this helps.)
Although the number of cholera cases started to decrease, the scourge still claimed victims, not least among the officers of the General Staff. On June 20th the staff officer Casati died, on July 2nd the commander of the Reserve Brigade, General Ansaldi. On July 5th the disease claimed the life of the the Sardinian Liaison Officer at French Headquarters, Captain Ansari di San Marzano. He was temporarily replaced by the Sardinian representative at British Headquarters, Captain Thaon di Revel, who had to combine the two functions.
Some days later La Marmora requested the Sardinian Government to appoint Captain Canera di Salasco as Liaison Officer to the French. Salasco was in the Crimea with the Novara Lancers.
His father has been a friend of General Pélissier, and the latter had good memories of their old friendship. La Marmora’s suggestion was accepted but, the mills of government grind slowly, and Salasco's official nomination was delayed until October
-----SEE TWO THREAD ENTRIES BELOW FOR MASSIVE SARDINIAN DETAILS
you seem to have insider knowledge of the Sardinian military operations. You're not part of the Sardinian Royal Family, are you?
What motivated the Sardinians to interfere on the Crimean pensinula anyway, allied with the Turks? You would think that after the fall of Constantinople and the Turko-Venetian wars, Italians wouldn't be friendly with Turks, but rather fight against them.
You raise a good point.Peter the Great sums it up well...
But you can look to the "influential" diplomatic savoir faire (or meddling... as they say ?)of the Inglese/English for indirectly financing Sardinian /Turkish involvement to protect their own interests (eg major India and African trade routes). Mutual back scratches.
Erm, the final fall of Konstantinopel took place on the 29. of May in 1453. As I understand Hank refers to the Sardinean units which were part of "allied" forces fighting the Russian armies during the Crimean War (1853-56) in 1855/56.
Huh, more than 400 years between!
The upcoming nationalism and emancipation of the "Italians" (there was no united "Italy" at that time, since it was splitted into several states and parts of its today territory were under Habsburger/Austrian control and don`t forget the then large Vatikan/Churchstate, ...) made the Sardiniens joining the "western" allies to bring up the "Italian Question" on the tables of politic of the European governments. With result: In 1859 the Sardinians and French fought a war against the Austrians (with little success though, but later conflicts and actions finally formed an Italian unity and state, but thats another story...)
Enrico may lighten up some with more detailed information!
So if following your argument, the French and the Germans would still be "Erbfeinde" (=arch enemies) because they fought 3 very bloody wars in just 75 years time span (1870/71, 1914-18, 1939-45), but in reality they`re partners in the EU & NATO and both nations believe in the "Deutsch-Französische Freundschaft" (=german-french-friendship)... .
As you`re from the states(?) you know that the US forces fought the Germans in 1917/18 and 1941-45 but how it comes that both nations (well for Germany now talking about the state of West Germany until 1989/90) are partners in the NATO sinc long (1955 signed by W.-G.)? THATS POLITICS MATE!
Like you already found out in 300/Spartans Thread - the Spartans fought the Persians and after that were allied with their former enemy against their "greece brothers", if someone reads just a little bit of his history lessons, he will notice very quickly the sneaky ways of politics and "diplomacy"... .
BTW the Crimean War wasn`t fought by the western allies for sympathy reasons toward the Turks/Osmans, it was first of a all a war AGAINST Russian DOMINATIN, but thats enough for today kids... .
Peter, I couldn't be writing a better and concise description (not in english, anyway...) of Piedmontese (not "italians"!) urge for taking part into an international coalition.
...Just like today
Thanks for your help guys. Well, I agree with you that it's pretty obvious that the Sardinians changed their minds on the Turks between 1453 and the Crimean war. And I didn't doubt that, my question was WHY did that happen and HOW? What were their motivations?
Peter is bringing up some nice examples of France, Germany and the US being friends and allies out of a sudden, after banging their heads together a few times. I guess we all know why that happened. They were afraid of a Communist invasion at the time they formed the NATO alliance.
Or it's the Romans and Visigoths fighting each other for centuries, then they ally against the Huns, then they fight against each other again. You know, in that case it's pretty simple to understand the motives of Goths and Romans to team up. They want to survive as independent people.
So, with the Sardinians and the Turks, was it fear, greed, peer pressure or what that caused them to ally against Russia? Were the Sardinians paid mercenaries like the Hessians in the AWI? That's the part that I don't understand.
Russia was no imminent threat to Sardinia, as those two countries lie very far away from each other. Plus the Russian people are quite civilized and well-behaved, much unlike the Huns. So I doubt it was the fear factor that caused Sardinia to join the attack against Russia. Just, what was it then?
as Peter said, Piedmonte needed to gain reputation amongst european powers as leading nation in the italian peninsula in his effort to join al the small states into a country.
The biggest problem was to bring Austria out to northern Italy; to defeat Neapolitan Kingdom could have been a relatively easy task (as it really was some year later thanks to Garibaldi) and also Church State without the french support (engaged by Prussia)was not a great problem.
And to defeat Austrian Empire was not possible (1848 lesson) without the help of european state: France had good reasons to create a relatively small state between his borders and Austria...
So, nothing against the distant Russian giant, and no real interest for Turkish matters, but... "business is business"
Alright, Enrico, I think I understand. Thanks for teaching me Italian history. It's 'manus manum lavat' how the Romans used to say.
Looks like the Crimean war really caused a lot of strife in the aftermath, possibly including WW1.
What I also learned today is that during the Crimean war, cigarettes were introduced to the Western world. Since cigarettes are undoubtedly today's enemy #1, one could argue that the Crimean war caused more harm and damage to human life than any other war in history.
While the Crimean War may have introduced cigarettes to the West, tobacco use in Europe dates back to its introduction from America, so we cant blame the Turks for that. I would suggest alcohol might be a more destructive vice than tobacco - at least smokers mostly kill themselves, but drunks often kill other people, and man has been distilling whatever he can get hold of to make alcohol since forever!
Nice thought Jon, but wrong. Second hand smoke is almost as dangerous, poisonous and cancerogenic as the primary inhalant (this is especially true for children and asthmatics).It's not just a nuissance. Also you will still find a lot more smokers than people with an alcohol addiction these days...
So if there are any smokers out there who read this line: Try to quit and buy a box of toy soldiers a day instead. The price is about the same :-)
Never mind tobacco smoke... firing weapons and being encased in clouds of gun smoke are the perfume of a battlefield. Causing larger than 1/72nd lifesive "boogers/bogies/snot" which delicately removed by a selected finger nail in a moments peace, when taking cover from enemy fire behind a barricade trench, helped reduces ones blood pressure.
Now able to breathe a deep breath and more oxygen into the bloodstream, its up, dash forward 10 yards and down....en avant mes braves.