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This is probably an unanswerable question but what do people feel about the appeal of Byzantines? Manufacturers seem to be wary of them. Obviously, Orion had a go but produced sets that tried to cover too much and had production issues, Hat showed some sketches but don't seem to have progressed the project and Strelets says definitely not. Are Byzantines cursed in some way? If no Roman sets existed or there was very limited coverage and a manufacturer had to decide whether to do Romans or Byzantines, of course, they would do Romans but we are pretty well served with Romans from all eras and it seems to me that Byzantines would be as good a choice as any, better than some. Perhaps they are just too vast and manufacturers are not prepared to take the risk on the multiple sets that would be needed. Although the same could be said of the WSS range that is currently being rolled out, even more vast if anything. Strelets have already told us that the golden age of large volume sales disappeared long ago. More generally it does interest me what prompts a manufacturer to choose what to do next. Is it personal interest in a subject? Interest demonstrated on this forum? Scientific Market research? Playing safe and ensuring that at least some of your production is focussed on tried and tested eras? I was very disappointed and a bit surprised to see Strelets rule out Byzantines as when it comes to medievals Nikephorian Byzantines would complement their existing range providing enemies for Normans in Italy and Islamic armies in the near East.
Linear - A is going to make this
039 Eastern roman empire (roman infantry set 1 )
040 Imprerial Guardsmen of Imperator Justinian 1
041 Ennemies of East rome 6 th century Ad
011 imperator Justinian 1 /imperatrix Theodora 1
best regard from wonderful Denmark
Yes Tommy they are promising some sets and I very much look forward to them but Linear A seem to be a bit of a specialist manufacturer that bring out a small number of quite focussed sets. Sadly for me these sets would be a bit early but is certainly a welcome development and I am pleased for people who want earlier Byzantines.
Yes, strange how an empire that lasted around 1,000 years and had a host of interesting and dangerous enemies, as well as some impressive forces of its own, has been neglected.
Maybe as you suggest it is just too mysterious and complicated ('byzantine'; in English means 'excessively-complicated' after all) for anyone to get to grips with. Having said that, there are plenty of metal wargames figures out there for the Byzantine Empire, and you only have to go to a wargames convention to hear Romano-Greek military terminology for different troop types etc being thrown into numerous conversations as a sort of patois...usually by wargamers who, despite their undoubted intelligence, would struggle to count from one to ten in modern Greek!
Maybe Redbox will come up with something? They have been good in the last few years at taking on periods and areas that others have not covered; and although their horses are sometimes suspect, the quality of their sculpting overall has improved a lot.
I think one of the main issues is most production over the years has tended to shade toward something that is related to that specific nation's history (arguably at least), so the Byzantines are left out a little bit. Americans companies tend to go more for Alamo/U.S. Civil War/World War II, British for Roman Invasion of Britain/Hastings/Waterloo, Russian companies for Mongolian Invasion/Rise of Muscovy/Great Northern War. But I think there is interest, when I asked about all ancient/medieval sets a few weeks ago Byzantines was the most popular answer by a large margin.
I completely support the idea of making Byzantines.As already indicated, just look at some 28 mm manufactures like - V and V Miniatures or Draband Miniatures, Crusader Miniatures etc.I also think that RedBox will be the best here...I just bought their Moscow Noble Cavalry sets. They're awesome ! Looks like this company is open for new subjects and challenges!Orion Byzantines are quite good but still not enough. Hope to see new Byzantines from Rdbox soon....
I feel for you Jerzy, you've been pushing for new Byzantines for years, I hope it finally happens. I think Caesar was supposed to do a Byzantines set but that has been lost in the shuffle like so many of their other sets (I'm still waiting for that WW2 Dutch-Belgian Army).
Thank you. I got info from Hat that they may start dooing Byzantines this summer.I do hope so...
Interesting about, I'd kinda given up, same as I did with the 1940 BEF.
It took Hat like 10 years to finish the Sassanids with a whimper. I got pretty fired up about the Sassanids bought the first packs. Then nothing. While I am waiting I paint hundreds of Late Romans, everything they had. Still no Elephants, even today. If Hat does the enough Byzantines at once to make an Army then we are talking, otherwise. Meh. I love how Strelets spews sets full of fun poses. Got me back into the hobby. Developing a range rapidly with new sets like WSS is exciting. All the Nappies coming out that's fun. I love the new sets and the old sets.
RedBox doing Byzantines set seems out of character for them, they have only made one set on a pre-1400 AD topic (their very first set, the Picts). Also shields are not their strength, as can be said for so many non-Strelets companies.
all we would need from strelets is some lombards and byzantines and we have everything we need to fight over italy.
I agree we need Lombards / Longobards and also Vandals. I don't know whether Byzantines will sell or not. All I know is that I will buy as many as I can in whatever period of their existence.We already have their various enemies over different periods: Huns, Moors, Rus, Normans. So please produce Byzantines. We wait in anticipation.
Difficult question to answer as its often hard to predict what might sell well or not but everytime a manufacturer launches out on a new era or subject they take some risk. In this case we are talking about the largest relatively uncovered subject up to the 15th century so there must be a good chance of serious interest which ,if the produced figures are of reasonable quality, would generate sales.
Even if HäT did go ahead and finally make their Byzantine sets (which on current form would probably take them several years anyway) there is still room for more as its a varied subject which has as much potential for multiple sets as the Roman Republic / Empire.
For me personally, the Byzantines never sparked much romance, passion, or interest. One of my buddies always loved to play them. He usually beat the crap out of my Carthaginians.
What I would love to see is a big box or series on Palmyra, playing up the pageantry of Queen Zenobia's court, guard cataphract camel corps, and other exotic desert Arab troops. Going a little Hollywood would be fine by me.
I dream from byzantines, late antique, 6-7th century against persians, german tribes, arabs and civil war fractions....
Haha, sounds similar to my little collection. The Vikings are considering raiding the Aztecs, but Tecumseh's men may beat them to the punch! :P
I would buy Byzantine sets simply because they are very useful for most scenarios, but do I dream of them? No. My dreams have Tlaxcala warriors, Japanese Bushi, Genpei War Samurai, Hittite Spearman and charioteers (that are NOT based off Egyptian iconography, *coughCaesarcough*), Mongolian civilians (especially women), Ghanaian/Malian warriors for Sundjata's campaigns, and Sforza's adventures around Milano. My dreams are a little exotic though. But basically if they appear in an Age of Empires II campaign, I am interested. :joy:
I am very pleased to see the planned sets by Linear A but I don't agree that they are covering this range, like the Romans there are at least 3 separate eras and a huge range of troop types so what has been done so far and what is promised has barely scratched the surface. As for the decision to produce a certain set, you are right the choices sometimes seem to defy logic, I know there is always someone somewhere who will want some of the most esoteric subjects but there are some seem to have real stabs in the dark, for example I be very interested to know who bought Russian warrior monk artillery!
I believe that a couple of sets of Byzantines would sell quite well if folks simply knew more about them. At the height of their power, the Byzantines had faced several major powers in the region. Arabs, Normans, The Rus, several nomad tribes, and Turks. I have studied Byzantine history in depth now for nearly two decades and the stuff is brilliant reading if one is interested. For a thousand years almost the Empire stood against all enemies and weathered them each in turn. Ultimately it boils down to which period or periods would get a produced. The Justinian period was certainly busy with the re-conquest of so much of the former empire. I believe though that we could still use Late roman figures for this period (just my opinion). For me the real period of Byzantine greatness stemmed from about 900 till 1100. Here you get the battles with the above mentioned factions. I would love to see them produced but know better than to get my hopes up. Hope you guys are all well and weathering the plague.
Cheers from the Old North State. Ole Ben.