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Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Yes Edwardian, you're right, the dudes on the box don't have a bag for grenades except the one throwing it. Well, as you have said, let's wait and see, I will be happy too also if they all wear caps instead of tricornes, a set dedicated to the french grenadiers is welcome.

Cheers,
Ale

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Edwardian
So here we have it.

http://www.strelets-r.com/Pages/Set.aspx?SetID=370&M=B

Some Grenadiers are good news, though I think that Grenadiers hardly warrant a full set, and I would have preferred them spread over 2-3 sets of fusiliers, in the way the British sets were handled. However, that's not the end of the world by any means and I'm delighted we're to have French Grenadiers.I look forward to seeing the Masters.

it is to be hoped that this set includes a drummer.

I would have preferred tricorns to caps, but I can headswap, so no problemo.

I only hope that there are poses compatible with the set 236 Fusiliers, so that I can rank them up together.

So, an important addition for completion of French infantry. Thanks and well done to Strelets.
Masters on the Strelets on news section ...really good ...hope to see now the pikes...I like the troops with breast-plates.

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Masters looking good! But I too miss a drummer. And that kneeling firing figure I always try to lobby for.

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Stelets, you bring us with these figures a little sunshine of joy in this very sad time with bad news.
In hommage of Mr. Edwardian, I would like to name them as "French Grenadiers + Unmounted Dragoons" ... ;_))

I like very the ordinary soldiers and the officers - simply great in poses and details -, but really again a fifer? Couldn´t it be a drummer? And please study better flagbearers: unfortunatly nor the size of the flag, nor the pose with one hand are well done and convincing.

I can only hope that we will see still one more set of french infantry ( in attack!) with enough drummers and hopefully without any NCOs. Please forgive me, but what shall I do with all your NCOs?

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

yes great looking figures, agree about need for drummer, this range for WSS promises to be outstanding, love the command figures, but i too would like to see less NCOs, otherwise congrats to Strelets

cheers Old John

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Obviously not a fifer, but an hautbois. The instrument, a bit short, however, and looks more like a shawm (the precursor of the oboe) which, normally, was no longer used by the French. Nevertheless, I like it. As mentioned elsewhere, the use of fifes had fallen out of vogue at the time. In the French army they were then used almost exclusively by Swiss units. But a drummer is needed as well, marching this time. And why not add the standing drummer of the failed set 234? As for the flag, yes, too small again and quite impossible to wield it like this, single-handed. Dismounted dragoons? Well, even when dismounted they should wear gaiters ...

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Maybe Strelets can replace the NCOs from the main sprue with the drummers, giving us a total of 4 per box, as a sort of compensation for the shortage in previous sets. I find it a reasonable thing to do. I wouldn't mind neither if it comes from the musketeers set as Master Kunz has suggested, which is a fairly detailed model.

As for the masters, the only questionable poses are those of the grenadier handling his sword in the air and the rather unnatural side-facing flagbearer (mould issue there?). Generally speaking, not a big issue.

I also insist on the inclusion of kettledrummers (ideally as a multi- part figures) in your planned cavalry sets. These were typical of the period. Besides anyone can easily think of other possible uses for them. It wont be too hard to convert them into 7YW cavalry musicians, for instance. That might broaden the intended scope of a set, improve its overall look and help with sales. I admitt though that I don't know how much of a technical challenge would be for Strelets to include them.

Anyway, keep it up!

N.



Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Initial thoughts:

A good and useful set I will be buying.

First officer, clearly a dismounted senior officer, so a little odd as a choice, but a nice figure, albeit one you might not need many of.

Hautbois player looks very nice, BUT NO DRUMMER!!!

Standard bearer is a bit of a silly pose (taken from a print of an early Eighteenth Century Lollipop Lady?). PSR will no doubt have a go at that one.

Second officer I like.

The picture of the ORs is small and hard to make out, but it seems that we may have a mix of hatted and capped grenadiers, which, in my view, is a good choice.

Further, the poses are good and look compatible with the set 236 Fusiliers, so adding Grendadier companies to battalions looks like it will be no problem.

Another very commendable effort by Strelets. Well done. Will be purchasing.

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Interesting set, with many useful figures. Thank you. I will certainly be buying this set.

I like the musketeer poses and the second officer. I particularly like the pose of the marching grenadier (dragoon?), and indeed all the grenadiers in caps are capable of 'conversion' to dismounted dragoons with a little work on their legs and a suitable paint job.

I too note the lack of a drummer, the sabre-wielding grenadier being a bit 'out of place' (a pirate pressed into the service of Louis XIV perhaps??), and the awkward pose and impracticality of the flag bearer. No matter, these have conversion potential in my book.

For those interested, the NCO with polearm is in a very good pose for conversion to a drummer. He requires a scratch-built drum on his left hip, obviously removal of his primary weapon beforehand, and a broad strap (paper or folded tinfoil strip) over his shoulder to suspend the drum. A little fiddly, but easy enough if you have a little experience of conversion and the right tools. I scratch-build drums from a short length of suitable gauge wooden dowel (rod), with paper rims top and bottom, detail (including cords) painted on. Drum sticks are short lengths of bristle from a kitchen washing up brush, inserted into small drilled holes in the figure's hands.

A set of mounted and dismounted dragoons would now be particularly welcome! The mounted figures would ideally be on standing or walking horses with suitably-posed riders ie: not charging or waving swords around. An appropriate number of dismounted dragoons skirmishing + a horse holder would be great. Perhaps 8 mounted and 8-10 dismounted in the set, plus a command sprue.

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Good conversion notes, there, as I tend to find I have an over-abundance of NCOs from these sets.

Likewise, the Set 234 conversions you and Paint Dog discussed will prompt me to try.

I also agree with what you say about dragoon poses, for the French.

This made me consider cavalry poses more generally, and my thoughts were:

- There may be little merit in dismounted British Dragoons

- French Horse could and should have poses firing from the saddle. The British should not.

This reflects that, at this time, the two armies appear to have followed different doctrine.

Reading descriptions of the French cavalry at Blenheim, their tactical doctrine appears to have been:

(i) advance (ii) fire (iii) charge (iv) run away

This seems in practice sometimes to have been abbreviated to (i) advance (ii) fire (iii) run away


The British version seems to have been: (i) advance (ii) charge (repeat if necessary)

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Edwardian
Good conversion notes, there, as I tend to find I have an over-abundance of NCOs from these sets.

Likewise, the Set 234 conversions you and Paint Dog discussed will prompt me to try.

I also agree with what you say about dragoon poses, for the French.

This made me consider cavalry poses more generally, and my thoughts were:

- There may be little merit in dismounted British Dragoons

- French Horse could and should have poses firing from the saddle. The British should not.

This reflects that, at this time, the two armies appear to have followed different doctrine.

Reading descriptions of the French cavalry at Blenheim, their tactical doctrine appears to have been:

(i) advance (ii) fire (iii) charge (iv) run away

This seems in practice sometimes to have been abbreviated to (i) advance (ii) fire (iii) run away


The British version seems to have been: (i) advance (ii) charge (repeat if necessary)
Hi Edwardian,
At lest least today I witnessed the same panic behaviour in my local Morrisons than on the continent: call it a sort of panicking.
So it seems the Brits are no longer so "keep calm" than before.
Santé !
CPN

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

"Reading descriptions of the French cavalry at Blenheim, their tactical doctrine appears to have been:

(i) advance (ii) fire (iii) charge (iv) run away

This seems in practice sometimes to have been abbreviated to (i) advance (ii) fire (iii) run away"

CPN

This has nothing to do with "panicking". Actually, Edwardian should have said "feigned flight" (or "turn-around") instead of "run away" (honi soit qui mal y pense :relaxed: ). This tactics was called "Volte-face", was mainly used when facing infantry, and has been well described e.g. in Manesson-Mallet's "Les Travaux de Mars", tome 3, p.120.

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k10431291/f140.image.r=les%20travaux%20de%20mars%20tome%203

Facing cavalry, similar tactics like "Caracol" and "Conversion" were used (ibid., pp.116ff.)

But of course you knew that. :wink:

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Indeed, I indulged myself in Pythonesque language when attempting to describe the French tactics of the day, with tongue firmly in cheek, I hope I can be forgiven!

Re: French WSS: Set 235 French Grenadiers (Early War)

Not sure that the honour of Les Mousquetiers or Gens D'Armes of the Maison du Roi would be so ready to forgive, Edwardian...but yes, for the mass of French cavalry the tactical doctrines of the period should ideally be reflected in forthcoming cavalry sets. Far too many mounted sets in our hobby portray troops in a frantic charge, and for the most part this is desperately unrealistic.

Let us also not get drawn into some impression that English cavalrymen of the period were somehow greatly superior on account of their use of 'cold steel'. The Swedish cavalry of Charles XII were justly famous and renowned in the early C18th for their employment par excellence of this tactic.

So yes, some great figures in this range with horses at a trot and with firearms in hand and sabres sheathed would be most welcome.....