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Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

PDA
But as you know, I have a hard time pinning down the exact start (and finish) dates. Did it start when Austria-Hungary commenced hostilities with Serbia, or when Franz Ferdinand was assassinated. Or perhaps the First Balkan War was actually the beginning of WW1.


I think you worry too much.

Ask anyone when WW2 started and they will most likely say September 1st, 1939. That is not a bad answer in my book because a war starts when the fighting starts.

But was it a World War then, you may ask, or only after the Commonwealth, or the U.S., entered? Or did it start altogether earlier with the Sino-Japanese war? etc. This might be important depending which specialist or regional perspective you choose but I fail to see it would help much in a general, non-specialist debate.

So, I'd say WW1 started with the hostilities betweeen two states, which was the fighting between the Austro-Hungarian empire and Serbia on July 28, 1914.

Might be too simple for someone but works for me. Regards, Pa

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

When did each participating Soveriegn Nation declare War in The Great War?

heres a list:

Australia
Entered war together with Britain on 4 August 1914

Austria-Hungary
Declared war with Serbia on 28 July 1914
Declared war with Russia on 6 August 1914
Declared war with Belgium on 28 August 1914
Declared war with Portugal on 15 March 1916

Belgium
Invaded by Germany on 3 August 1914

Bolivia
Severed relations with Germany on 13 April 1917

Brazil
Severed relations with Germany on 11 April 1917
Declared war with Germany on 26 October 1917

Bulgaria
Declared war with Serbia on 14 October 1915
Declared war with Romania on 1 September 1916

Canada
Entered war together with Britain on 4 August 1914

China
Severed relations with Germany on 14 March 1917
Declared war with Germany on 14 August 1917
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 14 August 1917

Costa Rica
Severed relations with Germany on 21 September 1917
Declared war with Germany on 23 May 1918

Cuba
Declared war with Germany on 7 April 1917

Ecuador
Severed relations with Germany on 8 December 1917

France
Invaded by Germany on 2 August 1914
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 12 August 1914
Declared war with Turkey on 5 November 1914
Declared war with Bulgaria on 16 October 1915

Germany
Declared war with Russia on 1 August 1914
Declared war with France on 3 August 1914
Declared war with Belgium on 4 August 1914
Declared war with Portugal on 9 March 1916

Greece
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 27 June 1917
Declared war with Bulgaria on 27 June 1917
Declared war with Germany on 27 June 1917
Declared war with Turkey on 27 June 1917

Guatemala
Declared war with Germany on 23 April 1918

Haiti
Declared war with Germany on 12 July 1918

Honduras
Declared war with Germany on 19 July 1918

Italy
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 23 May 1915
Declared war with Turkey on 21 August 1915
Declared war with Germany on 28 August 1915
Declared war with Bulgaria on 19 October 1915

Japan
Declared war with Germany on 23 August 1914
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 25 August 1914

Liberia
Declared war with Germany on 4 August 1914

Montenegro
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 5 August 1914
Declared war with Germany on 8 August 1914
Declared war with Bulgaria on 15 October 1915

New Zealand
Entered war together with Britain on 4 August 1914

Nicaragua
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 8 May 1918
Declared war with Germany on 8 May 1918

Panama
Declared war with Germany on 7 April 1917
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 10 December 1917

Peru
Severed relations with Germany on 6 October 1917

Portugal
Entered war against Germany on 9 March 1916
Entered war against Austria-Hungary on 15 March 1916

Romania
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 27 August 1916
Exited war with Treaty of Bucharest on 7 May 1918
Re-entered the war on 10 November 1918

Russia
Declared war with Turkey on 2 November 1914
Declared war with Bulgaria on 19 October 1915

San Marino
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 3 June 1915

Serbia
Declared war with Germany on 6 August 1914
Declared war with Turkey on 2 November 1914

Siam
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 22 July 1917
Declared war with Germany on 22 July 1917

Turkey
Declared war with Romania on 30 August 1916
Severed relations with United States on 23 April 1917

United Kingdom
Declared war with Germany on 4 August 1914
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 12 August 1914
Declared war with Turkey on 5 November 1914
Declared war with Bulgaria on 15 October 1915

United States of America
Declared war with Germany on 6 April 1917
Declared war with Austria-Hungary on 7 December 1917

Uruguay
Severed relations with Germany on 7 October 1917

from: http://www.firstworldwar.com/features/declarationsofwar.htm

Cheers

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

Belgium did not declare war on anybody. Is that true?

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

PDA
Belgium did not declare war on anybody. Is that true?


As far as I'm aware Belgium maintained her neutrality throughout the war, a declaration would have presumable been a breach of that.....

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

The Belgian Expeditionary Corps (of armoured cars) in Russia showed there was a way round the neutrality issue. They were deemed as volunteers in the Russian army.

Offensive operations were also carried out by the Belgian Force Publique in German territories in East Africa. The former German territories of Ruanda and Urundi became Belgian trustee territory after the League of Nations declaration in 1925.
Later on the Belgians fought in the Korean War as a volunteer corps (BUNC)together with the Luxembourgish. The Treaty of London still seemed to be holding in the 1950s.

BTW Luxembourg was also neutral in WWI and was given a similar ultimatum to the one given to the Belgians by the Germans.

Liberia declaring War on Germany in 1914 is an interesting one.

David

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

There were plenty of Volunteers from many "Neutral" nations during WW1 fighting in the Armies of France and Britain, Russia is probably no exception to this rule.....
Offensive actions in Africa can be considered defensive considering the nature of the warfare and terrain....

"What perpetual neutrality means.
When war breaks out between two or more States, the powers who are not at the
outset involved in the conflict are usually free to decide what
attitude they will maintain during the hostilities. Following the dictates of their own interests, they declare in
favour of one of the belligerents or they determine to remain
neutral, thus promising to give no support, directly or
indirectly, to the armies about to take the field. But such
an abstention is not always voluntary; it is sometimes imposed by international treaties which lay upon a State, so
restricted in all circumstances, except in case of being
attacked
, a strict obligation not to engage, in future, in
any warlike enterprise, and to maintain exclusively peaceable
relations with its neighbours : that is perpetual or permanent
neutrality."
From: The violation by Germany of the neutrality of Belgium and Luxemburg 1915

The response to the Ultimatum by Germany....

"There were two possible courses of action open to us:
The first was to allow a free passage to the German armies in their march
on France and to obtain a large indemnity for the damage suffered,
that would have meant the friendship of Germany today and her sovereignty
tomorrow. It would also have meant the tearing up of the title deeds of the
Belgian nation and the violation by her own hand of the neutrality which had been decreed by Europe and accepted by Belgium and treason to the duties
imposed upon us by that neutrality.
The alternative was to run the danger of war and invasion, to oppose the most formidable military power in the world and to keep our honour unstained,
to maintain our title, to respect our treaties.
There was no discussion. Our decision was plain before us. It was taken at once. We decided to protest and to resist."
From: The violation of the neutrality of Belgium (1915)

The Entry for Liberia in 1914 may not be correct other sources say 1917?

Cheers

Re: The lamps are going out all over Europe

I produced a lengthy reply but it was deemed to be spam and deleted-not the first time on this forum
So here is the short version

"There were plenty of Volunteers from many "Neutral" nations during WW1 fighting in the Armies of France and Britain, Russia is probably no exception to this rule....."

true but not my point

The instance I give is an example of much more than individuals volunteering and I think you know that. King Albert and Tsar Nicholas II as respective CinCs had arranged for the force to be transferred from the Belgian Yser front to Russia. Armoured cars and all by ship to Archangel. They then fought on the Galician front as a coherent unit. There were many (per head of population) Luxembourgish volunteers in the French army but these had volunteered and had nothing to do with the Luxembourg government's plans.

"Offensive actions in Africa can be considered defensive considering the nature of the warfare and terrain...."

Again true(and I was referring to German East Africa) especially of the Germans with Lettow Vorbeck's campaign but not my point.

The Belgians did have ambitions for territorial gains in German East Africa if not the whole colony as General Smuts indeed feared. Ruanda-Urundi (now two countries Rwanda and Burundi) became a Belgian trusteeship territory.

Both show a fairly flexible interpretation of neutrality. It seems that in both instances the legal implications had been considered and were catered for. I suppose showing how Belgian had been limited and compromised by the neutrality article in the 1839 Treaty is another approach or option. I have never seen anybody support the scrap of paper approach but it does have some valid aspects. The forts and rearmament, larger army etc in the early 1900s seem to suggest the Belgians were not that confident in the Treaty themselves.

RE Liberia
They declared neutrality in 1914

It was reported in the NY Times on Aug 7th 1917 that Liberia had declared War with Germany after a U boat had shelled Monrovia some give the date as Aug 4th and there are a few variations but 1917 not 1914.

Not quite sure what this has do with model plastic soldiers but never mind

David